In the third part of this extensive interview with ANF, Mustafa Karasu, member of the KCK (Kurdistan Communities Union) Executive Council, talked about the current situation in the Middle East and the region, focusing in particular on Turkey's policy and the way Tayyip Erdoğan is trying to save his own power in this phase.

The first part of the interview can be read here and the second here

One year has passed since the October 7 attack by Hamas. Israel’s extension of the war to Lebanon has greatly increased the dangers in the region. What has this one year of war shown, and what are the prospects for future developments?

It was known that Israel’s immediate goals were to crush Hamas and Shia Hezbollah. Israel was already preparing for this. When Hamas attacked Israel, killing more than a thousand civilians and capturing hundreds, Israel saw this as a historic opportunity to go for its goals. It was Erdoğan’s administration that made Hamas carry out this action. Thus, it aimed to sabotage both the energy route through Israel and the Abram Accords between Israel and the Arab countries. By ordering this attack, Erdoğan played the role of an agent provocateur in realizing the plans of Israel and the US for the region. Since Erdoğan’s personality is known, many powers are using him through certain provocations. Even though Erdoğan uses heavy anti-Israel rhetoric and portrays the US as its partner, he is an agent-provocateur used by the US. Erdoğan is a politician whose policies expose Turkey to the greatest dangers.

Erdoğan had Hamas attack Israel in the name of protecting Turkey’s geopolitical position. However, with his policies and with his blackmailing of allies, he himself has played a role in destroying Turkey’s geopolitical position. Thus, the fear of losing its geopolitical position, which is Turkey’s main source of political power, has alarmed Turkey. The Turkish state’s incoherent policy of protecting its position only through threats and blackmail has exacerbated its predicament. The policies from which it once gained short-term benefits have now rendered Turkey policyless.

The AKP-MHP government’s Kurdish genocide policy is the main factor that has put Turkey in a deadlock. So much so that it wants everyone to approach the Kurds the way it approaches them, and as a result, it has become problematic even with its allies. On the other hand, the fact that it is so intensely focused on the Kurdish genocide brings many powers to take advantage of this weakness of the Turkish Republic. In return for their support to the Turkish Republic against the Kurdish freedom movement, they have Turkey in the palm of their hand in many areas. It is not possible for a Turkey that is locked only on the Kurdish genocide to conduct effective politics in the Middle East. It is using and exhausting not only its economic but also its political and diplomatic means in the war against the Kurds. Turkey’s efforts to preserve its geopolitical position on the basis of realizing the Kurdish genocide are putting Turkey into more dead ends. In addition to losing its geopolitical opportunities, the problems it is having with its allies have thrown Turkey out of all political equations in the Middle East.

The US gives full support to Israel’s attacks. This means that Israel will increase its political and military influence in the region by neutralizing Hamas and Hezbollah. Iran, on the other hand, will lose its alliances in the region and turn inward, which will change Iran’s regional policies. Except for Iraq, its political influence will either disappear or be limited. The Houthis will continue to pursue Iranian-influenced policies for a while, but they will not carry out attacks in the Red Sea as they do today anymore, nor will they be in a position to force the Saudis. In short, there will be significant changes in the political situation compared to before October 7, 2023. Even if there are mutual attacks between Israel and Iran, in the end, Iran’s regional policy based on its external forces will be limited. This will also have implications for Iranian domestic politics in the medium term. Undoubtedly, the establishment of Israeli influence and the containment of Iran will not solve the problems in the Middle East. It is not possible for Israeli policies, the US, and the regional nation states to solve the problems. Therefore, in the Middle East, where states do not solve problems and even aggravate them, a period will be entered in which the peoples themselves will be more in the position to decide over their own fate.

It is clear that Israel cannot carry out a regional policy based on its foreign support and military power. In this respect, it is clear that it will also have to change its policy. A step in this direction has already been taken with the Abrams Accord. Israel can only secure its existence within the framework of a regional agreement and democratic relations with the peoples of the region. From this point of view, I want to point out once again that the solution to the Israeli-Palestinian conflict can only develop and become permanent through Democratic Confederalism, in which each Democratic Nation and community has the will to administer itself. There is no other solution. Otherwise, enmity, tension, and conflict will continue. It is clear that a solution inevitably imposes itself.

Turkey cannot make Israel look unstable and insecure and block the energy route agreed by the G20. It does not have the power to stand up to such hegemonic powers. Their blackmail will no longer work. The only way for Turkey to feel secure is to solve the Kurdish question and democratize. When Turkey democratizes, it will be able to have a political, economic, and cultural impact on the peoples of the Middle East.

In addition to Israel, it is above all the Turkish state, or more precisely the fascist Erdoğan, who is propagating the war. He is trying everything to further expand the war and is trying to stage himself as a friend of the Palestinian people through lies in order to exploit them. Now the fascist Erdoğan is talking about Israel having its eye on “our country.” What is Erdoğan trying to achieve with such rhetoric?

Turkey has acted with the approach that if the war becomes widespread, not only will it be needed, but also the Abram Accord will collapse and an environment will be created in which a significant part of the energy route will pass through its geography. It was their calculation that if Israel and Iran went to a full-scale war, Iran, its main rival in the region, will be weakened and Israel will be dependent on Turkey. The main reason for its anti-Israel stance is not its friendship for Palestine; it wants Israel and the US to take Turkey into consideration in the region. It is not like Erdoğan is allied with the US on the one hand and anti-Israel on the other. He feels very marginalized and wants to be taken into consideration. This is how Turkey’s policy behind its anti-Israel stance should be understood.

They know that Israel will not attack Turkey. But with such rhetoric, he mainly aims to achieve two goals. First of all, by putting a country like Israel on the agenda in this way, Turkey imposes on both the US and Israel, which has influence over the US and Europe, to take it into consideration in the region. It sees the loss of its geopolitical position as a question of survival. This is because it fears that if it loses its geopolitical position, the US and Israel will approach Turkey negatively. For this reason, by being anti-Israel and constantly saying things to the US, it wants to dissuade these powers from their negative attitudes towards it and even to be taken into consideration politically. It has always pursued this policy until now. Now Erdoğan says that if he does this, he will achieve results. Of course, the context has changed a lot; it is debatable how much this policy will yield results.

Secondly, while the war continues in the region, Erdoğan is trying to create a common external enemy and align the entire opposition and society behind him against it. Maybe the opposition is even aware of this, but it seems to have an effect on society, so they give in. All politicians and state institutions know that Israel will not attack. The foreign and defense ministers who give information in closed session also know this. In closed session, they probably used the one sentence in the Torah about the promised land as a justification for their claims. On the other hand, they are trying to frighten the public and political forces that if Israel spreads the war, many refugees would come. Until now, Israel’s best friend in the Middle East was Turkey. Many powers are interpreting it differently by saying that Turkey is in Israel’s crosshairs. the second Israel. Now they are interpreting it differently by saying that Turkey is in Israel’s crosshairs. They are trying to use the religious feelings of the society. There is no threat from Israel, but it is clear that AKP-MHP policies are a great threat and danger for Turkey. As a result of these alliance policies, Turkey has been turned into a problematic country both at home and abroad, and they have put Turkey in a weak position both at home and abroad with Kurdish hostility.

Behind the statement “Israel’s eyes are on our land,” Erdoğan says that Rojava and North and East Syria are under Israeli control and that calculations are being made on Turkey from there. All their policies, relations, and discourses are based on Kurdish hostility. Whoever does not support them in their Kurdish hostility at the level they want, they accuse them of dividing and dismembering Turkey. Even when they say that Israel has “eyes on our land,” they say so in order to target the Kurds. This is how they are trying to increase the social support for their attack on Rojava. Thus, if it crushes Rojava, Israel will no longer have “eyes on our land.” So in conclusion, they are saying that Israel has its eyes on their homeland, and in order to prevent this, they need to invade Rojava and North and East Syria and carry out the Kurdish genocide. That is the main expression of Erdoğan’s rhetoric.

While Tayyip Erdoğan is the representative in Turkey and the Middle East for regression, injustice, lawlessness, immorality, misogyny and many other reprehensible things, he tries to present himself as a man of justice, law and human rights. He even stands before the United Nations and says that he will teach humanity a lesson. How should this be judged?

Erdoğan is a complete demagogue. He is a demagogue who talks as if he has good qualities that he does not have and characterizes his opponents with the worst things. There has never been a politician in history who distorts the facts so much. It can be said that he is a master at this. He is a master of demagoguery.

About a month ago, he spoke about the importance of justice at the opening of the new judicial year. He listed one after another all the beautiful words and evaluations that have been said in history on this subject. He said things that everyone would approve of. However, throughout his rule, especially in the last ten years, he did the opposite of all these things. There was only one thing he got right: the construction of courthouses. After all, states build big courthouses so that the public will be afraid. The policies pursued create so many criminals or people are easily accused that they build big courthouses. In fact, the largest number of prisons were built during the AKP rule. In the last ten years, injustice in society has increased so much that there is so little trust in the justice system as never before in the history of Turkey. Prosecutors and judges have come under the direct control of the government. Especially in the political sphere, injustice has reached its peak. Erdoğan has repeatedly given instructions to prosecutors and judges. Through the Ministry of Justice, they are instructed how to approach which crimes. At first, the Fethullahists dominated this field, but then a judicial system directly under the command of the AKP was formed. When the MHP joined the alliance, MHP supporters became influential among prosecutors and judges as well. Political cases are being directly intervened in. Thousands of people, especially Kurds and democratic politicians, have been imprisoned on trumped-up grounds. They have enacted a so-called anti-terrorism law that enables them to claim that everyone is associated with terrorism and throw them into prisons. The cases of Selahattin Demirtas and Osman Kavala are proof of how the law has been put in the service of political power. The European Court of Human Rights (ECHR) makes a decision, but then Tayyip Erdoğan intervenes, opens a new case, keeps them in prison, and thus lets the decision of the ECHR come to nothing. Selahattin Demirtas and Osman Kavala are just two well-known of countless other examples. This is what is being practiced on all opponents, especially Kurds. Among nation states, the Turkish state ranks among the lowest in law and the highest in corruption.

Especially in the last ten years, injustice has peaked in this country. Turkey has become an unjust country. Yet Tayyip Erdoğan stands on the podium and talks about how much importance they attach to law and justice without blushing. Shamelessness indeed! One of the most crucial characteristics of being human is to be ashamed and blush when there is a reason for it. Erdoğan does not have a trace of these beautiful human qualities. For Erdoğan, justice is for himself and his cronies. Others, especially political opponents, do not have this right. According to Erdoğan, justice is not applied to them; they deserve to be treated unjustly. In front of many institutions, there is a figure of a blindfolded woman with a scale in her hand, representing justice. When justice is administered, one does not look at who the person is. Erdoğan’s courts, on the other hand, look first and foremost at who it is and if the person might be against them. The most resonant slogan in Turkey right now is ‘right, law, justice’. It has become the first priority of the people of Turkey. It is said that ‘justice is the foundation of property’. At the very moment, as justice has collapsed, the state has also rotted and collapsed.

Erdoğan is a man without conscience. After all, the unjust cannot have a conscience. He talked about human rights and conscience at the UN. Turkey is at the bottom of the human rights rankings. Erdoğan has ruled this country for 22 years. Is there anyone else in the world who says to a power or a society he is fighting against that he will do what is necessary, even if it is a woman or a child? Even Netanyahu did not openly say that he would take action against women or children. Erdoğan talks about Netanyahu bombing mosques, but Erdoğan’s fascist government also bombed and destroyed more than ten mosques with the pretext that there were PKK members inside. In Roboski, Erdoğan ordered the massacre of a group of people, mostly children, on the allegation that there was one PKK member among them. However, there was not a single militant in this group. None of the murderers of children, women, or civilians killed by soldiers and policemen in Turkey have been prosecuted. There is impunity for soldiers and police officers. They are not punished because the fight against terrorism would be weakened. There are thousands of such cases that happened during the AKP rule. During the self-administration resistance in the cities of northern Kurdistan, Tayyip Erdoğan personally gave orders for massacres to soldiers and policemen, telling them “you don’t need to worry about judicial persecution.” He gave orders to burn people alive.

The Turkish state massacred thousands of civilians, women, and children during the invasions of Afrin, Serekaniye, and Gire Spî. Erdoğan gave the order for this. Just a day ago, two children, who were siblings, were massacred in Minbij, and there were even more wounded in the family, including further children. There are hundreds of such incidents in Rojava and North and East Syria. Again, hundreds of civilians, dozens of them children, were killed in the bombings of the Medya Defense Areas. All of this is happening under Erdoğan’s rule. More bombs are being dropped on the guerrillas than Israel is dropping on Gaza. The Turkish state’s UCAVs are on the hunt to murder people everywhere. They massacre people without discriminating between guerrillas and civilians. The gangs and mercenaries they organize kidnap people in Afrin. Hundreds of thousands of people in Afrin, Serekaniye, and Gire Spi were forced to leave their lands after the invasion attacks of the Turkish state. These people are trying to survive in tent cities under the most severe conditions.

Erdoğan’s government is a misogynist government. Even though it is so, it presents itself as a defender of women. However, misogyny and femicide in Turkey peaked during the AKP rule. All women’s movements are struggling against the misogynist policies of the AKP government. Because they see the AKP government as having a mentality that puts women under the domination of men since it conducts a family policy in which the man is recognized as the head and the will of the woman is completely absent. While women see Tayyip Erdoğan as the representative of the dominant male and patriarchal mentality, he almost tries to present himself as a feminist. The extent to which he is a demagogue is also seen in this approach.

The AKP government is the pioneer of reaction, anti-democracy and misogyny not only in Kurdistan and Turkey but in all the Middle East. The crimes committed during the AKP rule are incalculable. Yet they still talk about justice and human rights! There are 25 million Kurds in Turkey, but neither their identity, culture nor language is recognized. Through state force, oppression and massacres, Kurds are being subjected to cultural genocide and Turkified. This unjust, unscrupulous, immoral man who pursues a policy of genocide against the Kurds wants to convince the people, that he defends the Palestinian people! He wants to completely occupy Rojava and North and East Syria and expel the Kurds from their lands and commit genocide through demographic change, and at the same time he tries to lecture humanity at the UN! This is how shameless, unscrupulous and immoral Erdoğan is. He really excels in hypocrisy and shamelessness.