Mustafa Karasu, member of the KCK Executive Council, spoke about the latest developments in Kurdistan, the Middle East and the world, including the current situation of Abdullah Öcalan's physical isolation, the continuing genocide against the Kurdish people, the Turkish state's war of occupation in South Kurdistan/North Iraq with the help of the KDP.

The Kurdish Freedom Movement is facing all kinds of attacks. One of the most significant is the isolation of the leader of the Kurdish people, Abdullah Öcalan. What can you tell us about his current situation?

An attack against the struggle of a people is always first and foremost directed against its leadership and political organization. Because without destroying them, a people's struggle for freedom and democracy cannot be prevented and a people cannot be subjected to genocide. Since the resistance of Şêx Said and the people of Dersim, it was always the leaders who were massacred. Rêber Apo [Abdullah Öcalan] has always considered the execution of Şêx Saîd as the beginning of the Kurdish genocide. In this respect, the struggle against the Kurdish genocide and the struggle against the isolation of Leader Apo are intertwined. Therefore, the policy of isolation pursued against Rêber Apo in the prison of Imrali is part of the policy of the Kurdish genocide. A reality that must be well recognized by the Kurds is, that without an effective struggle against the isolation, there can be no effective struggle against the Kurdish genocide. A people always fights together with its leaders, its political movement and its organization, and thus gains its own power. Now that there is a genocidal attack against Rêber Apo, there of course has to be a struggle against this. This struggle has been continuing for nearly 25 years now. Today, unions, municipalities and intellectuals all over the world have joined the struggle for the freedom of Rêber Apo, because his freedom is not only in the interest of the Kurds or the democratic forces in Turkey, but has become the interest of humanity as a whole.

Nevertheless, the Turkish state persistently continues its policy of isolation and genocide. For example, Merdan Yanardağ [editor-in-chief of the Turkish television channel ‘Tele 1’] recently commented on Rêber Apo's stance in Imrali. He said that no prisoner in the history of Turkey had ever experienced such a system. He is a political leader who has been imprisoned longer than anybody else [in Turkey]. Merdan Yanardağ said this himself. He also stated that there was no legal basis for this in Turkey. Why is Rêber Apo not allowed to meet with his lawyers? Why is the way to get him out of prison blocked, even though he has been imprisoned for so long? Yanardağ criticized this and actually made an assessment as to why Turkey does not obey its own laws. In response to this, he was immediately arrested. In the past, there have been similar cases, e.g. Şebnem Korur Fincancı who was arrested because of a statement relating to the use of chemical weapons [by the Turkish army].

Because the link between democracy in Turkey and the Kurdish question has still not been established, democratization is not making any progress in Turkey. Without establishing the link, there wouldn’t be any development. Those who call themselves leftists, democrats or liberals but do not stand up against the isolation of Rêber Apo are only deceiving themselves. Undoubtedly, the struggle against the Kurdish genocide and isolation is the struggle for the democratization of Turkey. Therefore, this topic must not be taken off the agenda. This struggle needs to be fought constantly. It needs to be seen as part of the struggle for democracy and freedom. It is important that stopping the Kurdish genocide and fascism becomes the highest priority of our struggle.

For several years now, the Turkish state has been waging an intensive war in the South Kurdish Medya Defense Zones. A new offensive was launched just a few days ago. What can you tell us about the latest situation in the area?

Just like in 2015, they [the Turkish army] recently launched a comprehensive attack on the day of the anniversary of the Treaty of Lausanne with the intention of occupying the [South Kurdish/North Iraqi] areas of Zap, Metîna and Avaşîn. Symbolic days like this are very important to the Turkish state.

By launching this attack, they openly show that it is their essential interest to complete the Kurdish genocide and achieve the real purpose of the Treaty of Lausanne. This applies to all Kurdish forces, including the KDP and PUK, to all four parts of the country, i.e. also Rojava and East Kurdistan [West Iran], and in general to everyone. The attack on the anniversary of the Treaty of Lausanne is an attack against all Kurds. It is not only an attack against the Kurds of North Kurdistan. Because the Treaty of Lausanne is an agreement to carry out the Kurdish genocide. This is how it should be understood. That’s why we say that the attack is very comprehensive.

Of course, there is also a big and historical resistance against this policy. Despite the fact that the Turkish army has been waging this war since 2021 and despite the fact that they are using all kinds of military equipment, strategies and techniques, they have not been able to achieve any results.

Of course, this war was discussed during the recent NATO summit. The NATO representatives keep saying: ‘We understand the sensitivities of the Turkish state’, thus ignoring the fact, that by doing so they legitimize the genocide of a people, namely the Kurdish nation.

The Turkish state tries to legitimize its war by repeating the following: ‘We are not against the Kurds. We are fighting terrorism’ and ‘We are not against the Kurds. Look, we have relations with the KDP’. So they use their relationship with the KDP to cover up their genocidal policy. NATO is doing the same thing. It also claims not to be against the Kurds and refers to its relations with the KDP as proof. So it has to be acknowledged that NATO is an active partner on the Turkish side in this war. Of course, the KDP is supporting them since the war is taking place in the areas that are formally under the KDP’s military control. The KDP limits the movement of the guerrilla forces and tries to divide the areas in order to prevent any support for them. This must also be understood as KDP support for these attacks.

It is clearly not enough to simply observe these attacks. Nor is it enough just to point out the heroic and sacrificial resistance of the guerrillas. The people as a whole, especially the young people and women, have an essential role to play in this resistance. The fascist Turkish state pursues a policy of genocide, including the elimination of the guerrillas as an essential part of it. That is why a broad anti-fascist struggle is necessary. Therefore, I call on all the people, intellectuals, political parties and all those who call themselves Kurdish to stand up and reveal the real face of the Turkish state.

On what kind of other methods does the Turkish state rely in its war against the Kurdish people?

One of the most common methods that the Turkish state is currently using to suppress the Kurdish people's struggle for freedom is spying on people. The state tries to buy people and if they refuse to spy, they start to oppress them, threatening their families, threatening to ruin their business or telling them that they will be thrown in prison and never get out. The most basic method of special warfare that the Turkish state is currently waging against the Kurds is spying. It is the greatest enmity to pressure  people to become spies.

The public must see that this state is an enemy of the Kurdish people, which does not even recognize the Kurds as human beings. The only good Kurd is a scoundrel, spy and traitor in their eyes. This has become very widespread and must be condemned by society. Traitorship and spying are the world’s greatest evils. This is immoral, unscrupulous and deserves to be called every kind of name. That is why we call on everybody to be very sensitive regarding this topic. Yes, there is a lot of pressure from the state, but it is no option to surrender. Even death is better than this. And for the people who have surrendered and committed betrayal in the past, the only way to regain their humanity is to admit their guilt and show regret.

You have already mentioned several times that the Turkish state is carrying out a genocide against the Kurds and that it is an essential goal of Turkey’s government to bring this to a conclusion. What exactly do you mean by this? What is Kurdish society faced with at the moment?

When we talk about a genocide carried out against the Kurdish people, what we really mean is cultural genocide. This is not about physical elimination, which means that all Kurds will just be slaughtered. Cultural genocide is even worse because it was a social massacre, a mass murder. With a physical massacre, you can kill 50,000 or 100,000 people. With cultural genocide, you can carry out a genocide of millions.

Kurds who turn Kurdish folk songs and traditional music into Turkish songs and who call themselves Turkish artists are part of this genocide. They are more guilty than those who have killed hundreds of people. As a Kurdish society, we must be sensitive with regards to cultural genocide, especially the Kurdish youth. At the moment, the Kurds are being subjected to genocide mainly at the cultural level. They want the Kurdish identity to cease to exist. In this regard, not only Kurds but all people must take a stand. In particular, artists, authors and intellectuals need to play an essential role.

It is necessary to declare those who go to festivals [that serve the cultural genocide] as active supporters of the Kurdish genocide. Whether they are Turkish artists or Kurdish artists, leftists or whatever, if they become part of it, then they become perpetrators of the Kurdish genocide. These festivals are not organized to make Kurds and the Kurdish youth cultural and social. They are part of a special warfare strategy. Whether an attack on the Kurdish people with atomic bombs or a cultural attack on such festivals, this is the same thing and far from being something innocent. This is more dangerous than weapons because weapons that kill are easily recognizable. Everyone should be sensitive with regards to this issue and take a stand against such festivals. Those who attend these festivals should be condemned, isolated and exposed.