In the final part of this interview, Mustafa Karasu, member of the KCK (Kurdistan Communities Union) Executive Council, said that in Turkey "there is a direct attack against democratic values, democratic mechanisms, and democratic mentality."

The first part of the interview can be read here, and the second here. 

Talking about the situation in Turkey in general; how do you see the increased pressure from the government on the CHP and the opposition?

In fact, it would be more appropriate not to say “pressure on the opposition”; there is a direct attack against democratic values, democratic mechanisms, and democratic mentality. This is how one should evaluate the events in Istanbul and Turkey. We should not only focus on CHP here as well. Because the Kurds are experiencing the most suffering under the repression. More than 150 mayors were unlawfully arrested and replaced with trustees. What they always use as a pretext is that municipalities would transfer state resources to terrorist organizations, but this is nonsense. It is all slander. Not a single penny was transferred, and they knew it themselves. The Kurds know this situation well. Now the government is trying to do similar things to the CHP. And they use completely fabricated, false justifications. They are producing fake reasons and pretexts to seize the municipalities. The reasons that they claim in Istanbul may be different from the ones in Amed, but it is basically the same logic: They don’t want the opposition to be effective in municipalities.

Under the pretext of “urban reconciliation”, municipal administrations close to the AKP or other parties have sometimes made compromises. Now the opposition is being targeted. What is being done to Ekrem Imamoğlu and others is completely undemocratic and unlawful; it is abuse of the judiciary. Democracy means tolerating the opposition. It means tolerating different views, recognizing their role in the democratic struggle. But they are abusing the judiciary. Kurds have a lot of experience with this. Therefore, the Kurdish stance on what happened in Istanbul is clear. Who can still trust this government? Who still believes in Turkey? Definitely not Kurds. It’s hard to say what the situation is like in Turkish society, but even there only the hard-line AKP supporters still believe.

Narrowing the space for democracy, abusing the judiciary, suppressing the opposition… How will a group that behaves like this solve the problems in Turkey? How will they take democratization steps? Especially the Kurdish question, which cannot be solved in any other way than democratization. It is basically not possible. These practices are completely undemocratic. The struggle of the people and the youth against this is a just and democratic struggle. From this point of view, this practice in Istanbul is a sabotage to the process Rêber Apo is trying to develop. It is to increase suspicions. The opposition is questioning how the Kurdish question will be solved with such a mentality, and they are doing so rightly. The AKP-MHP fascist government has put the “urban reconciliation” at the center of these repressions against the opposition. On the one hand, they say “Kurdish-Turkish brotherhood”; on the other hand, they terrorize the urban consensus, which could be an important practical prototype of Kurdish-Turkish brotherhood. Doesn’t this constitute a contradiction in itself? Actually, it is both a contradiction and not. Because until four or five months ago, there was no such discourse of “brotherhood with Kurds”. Any Kurd was seen as a traitor. There was nothing in the name of democracy. Now, when there is a new process, it is as if they are saying “historical brotherhood with the Kurds”, but when there is a situation called urban reconciliation, they terrorize. So that previous understanding is still there; they haven’t let it go.

Suleyman Soylu, for example, defends different things by saying, “An agreement with HUDA PAR,” and so on. He is living his own reality. To him, Kurds who are not the majority in Istanbul and Izmir can be in the administration; they appoint trustees in places where they are the majority. He is completely Kurdish-hostile. So their mentality is the same: A Kurd who lives with his own identity and resists can never come side by side with a Turkish party. Only a Kurd who rejects his identity and surrenders can be reconciled. Ozgür Ozel responded to this and said that he embraces the "urban reconciliation". This is what should be embraced. Because how else will the Kurdish-Turkish relationship be established?

In Turkey, especially since 2015, the AKP-MHP government has exerted a lot of pressure. It acts like a fascist dictatorship. It does not let anyone breathe, particularly the Kurds and, in general, the youth. The pressure is unimaginable. Tens of thousands of Kurds are imprisoned and persecuted. Thousands of villages have been burned and destroyed. Particularly in the last ten years, they have committed unprecedented atrocities.

Sometimes there are discussions on TV about whether there will be a solution process; they are talking about all the soldiers and policemen that have died. Kurds have been and still are severely persecuted. Torture, imprisonment, maiming, and murdering of children are what the state imposes on the Kurds in the course of this war. Society in Turkey is also under pressure. They say they spent 4 trillion dollars on the war; poverty is rampant. Young people cannot breathe anymore. Youth, by nature, wants to express itself and seeks innovation. This government stifled it. In the history of Turkey, the youth have an important role in the struggle. The 68 generation had a great struggle. So were the 70s, in which high prices were paid. The youth was partially revived in the 90s. This is a tradition. Now they are speaking about a Gen Z, but we are talking about a youth tradition. It is passed on. Society passes on its resistance and methods to the youth. It is not only a matter of today’s technical and communication age. There is such a historical tradition. This is why the youth stood up. I remember the 70s; there was almost no young person who was not politicized. There were fascists, islamists, socialists; there was a very widespread youth movement. Youth is always a transformative element. It is the first to reject the status quo with the struggle it is involved in. The spirit of the youth also has a share in Ozgur Ozel’s or the CHP’s more radical stance recently.

There have also been notable events and developments outside Kurdistan itself, such as the Permanent Peoples’ Tribunal and the Kurdish Conference. Have you been able to follow this?

The Rojava tribunal was important, especially at this time. There are efforts by the group surrounding Colani and HTS to take over power; they are very undemocratic. It is not clear where they will take Syria. In such a process, it was important to put the crimes committed by the Turkish state in Rojava on trial and to discuss the situation in Syria in general. It is important to keep it on the agenda. It has set an agenda, and it will have further impact on public opinion. That is good, and I am convinced of it.

The mentioned Kurdish conference is important as well. Moreover, it was important that it was held after the call of Rêber Apo [Leader Abdullah Öcalan]. It was a conference guided by the principles of the call. In the discussions, clear demands were reached: Rêber Apo’s freedom, the Turkish state to take steps, the PKK to be removed from the terror list… Those who attended voiced their support.

Then there was the support of the Kurdish people and their international friends in Europe on the occasion of Newroz. We attach great value to all of this and salute the organizers and participants of the festivities and the conference. We believe that their efforts will surely bear fruit.

Finally, I would like to talk to you briefly about April 4, the birthday of peoples leader Abdullah Öcalan. Why is this day so important for your movement and the people?

It is clear that an objective evaluation shows that the birth of Rêber Apo is also the birth of the Kurdish people. One can understand what the reality of Rêber Apo means for Kurdish society by looking at the results of 50 years of struggle. That is why the Kurdish people see it as their own birth. They see it as the birth of their passion for freedom, their passion for resistance, and the struggle for the existence of their identity and culture.

For this reason, they must take responsibility for Rêber Apo. The birthday of Rêber Apo should also be seen as the day of the birth of the struggle, the day when the seed of the emerging values and achievements was planted. The birthday of Rêber Apo should be given such a meaning. Public celebrations are very important, and so is the celebration in the village of Amara.

It is meaningful to plant thousands, hundreds of thousands of saplings everywhere on the birthday of Rêber Apo. This birth should be given such a concrete meaning. This has become a tradition, but it should be even stronger and more effective. I also celebrate Rêber Apo’s birthday. The birthday of Rêber Apo is the birthday of all of us. This is how we interpret it. I believe that our people in the four parts of Kurdistan and abroad will celebrate this day properly and show their attachment and loyalty to Rêber Apo.